Navigating the Realities of Startup Life with E-Man and Ky

Speaker 1: 0:04

Hello and welcome to Underdogs, bootstrapers and Game Changers. This is for those of you that are starting with nothing and using business to change their stars, motivating people who disrupted industry standards. This is the real side of business. This isn't Shark Tank. My aim with this podcast is to take away some of the imaginary roadblocks that are out there. I want to help more underdogs, because underdogs are truly who change the world. This is part of our Content for Good initiative. All the proceeds from the monetization of this podcast will go to charitable causes. It's for the person that wants it. Hello and welcome back to Underdogs, bootstrapers and Game Changers. A little bit different episode today. I've invited a couple guys we've been working with around Glaive starting their new business. It's hard for me sometimes to remember way back to when I started and some of the intricate details that could help you, so I thought today we'd have a different type of discussion. I got my man E-Man here, I got Kai Yo. Welcome guys.

Speaker 2: 1:09

I appreciate you having us man, yeah, no.

Speaker 1: 1:11

This is a pleasure, you know, like I've. Really, this show is all about helping people new in business, kind of struggling with their business, kind of filling in where the rich uncle usually would you know, to kind of like fill in all the gaps to what business is and what better way. You guys are just starting in business and this is all kind of new to you. You remember better of like what's been a struggle and what's not been a struggle and what was like something you thought was hard and you know it wasn't so much. So I thought it would be a great way to have a conversation and help everybody at home. Yeah, it's dope.

Speaker 2: 1:41

We could just take one second just to edify you and Elliot man, really just here at the studio, and then also with Glaive. The amount of help that you guys have given us has been tremendous and honestly we don't think that we've been able to do without you guys.

Speaker 3: 1:54

Appreciate that a lot, yeah for sure, especially when you talk about like that rich uncle that steps in. We definitely don't have that To be able to sit there and like, truly, just like even just giving us a space to work. And it's not like you weren't sitting there walking us through every step. But when we did have a question, like you guys are willing to step up and help us out, like that means the world to us. Like I was saying, there are so many things that popped up that we would have had so many questions on that we were able to get answered just right then and there it was game changing for us.

Speaker 1: 2:22

You know part of it's like you remember dealing with a math problem and it's like if you just have somebody that shows you the math problem right off the bat, you're probably not going to get it right. But if you sit there and struggle with it just a little bit but then not so long that you're banging your head against the counter, you know like, then you can step in and like, hey, teacher, solve this part for me, right. Like I think that's like where people need the most help. Yeah, because, like we talked with you guys. It's like, remember you? You talked to us about helping you build a website. You know it's like, and what was the first thing I told you?

Speaker 2: 2:50

Yeah, you basically just tell me like okay, you got to do yourself. Yeah, and like anytime that you have any type of questions, like we're right here to help you, and if you do have a question then we will help you, but you at least have to eat your feet wet. So in the future, when you are like a big corporation or a big business or whatever you want to call it, then you can actually sit there and know how it's ran. So if you do have somebody else in charge in it or you have somebody overlooking it, you can step in yourself and double check their work.

Speaker 1: 3:14

Absolutely. I mean, you need to be able to manage it right At some point. All businesses have a website these days, you know, and so that's like. So I had a guy on on the last episode and he talked about so he owned a landscaping company if you watched the last episode and and then he transitioned to a tech company, right, and originally he went out and did what everybody tells you in the world to do just hire somebody and manage it right. And so he got robbed for all kinds of money, you know, because he didn't know what he was doing. Or you know, I know countless people that will come in here. It's like I have one friend that spent $60,000 on her website and it gets zero organic kits right. I have another person I was working with the other day $12,000 on their website, zero organic kits besides their name. Obviously you know and, and so it's. It's super frustrating, and that was one thing I wanted you guys to realize is like, don't pay $15,000 for the website, build it yourself right. Now you understand it, you're starting to understand how SEO works, and like all this is going to go together right, not only for this business but the future. And then, yes, when you hire that SEO person, you know. Now you can know if they're like filling you full of crap or not.

Speaker 2: 4:21

Right, yeah, absolutely. I think that was honestly huge for us because, like, when we came in and I first talked to you, I was like I was like no man, you know, like the Lord has blessed us, so like I just want to hire someone.

Speaker 3: 4:31

I don't even want to deal with it.

Speaker 2: 4:32

And like you really looked me down the aisle you're like, hi, no, you can't do that. And honestly I'm very grateful because, like the amount of knowledge that I've even learned just going through the website, also like I've probably put in like 40 to 50 hours on the website and there's still so much to learn to it, but it's honestly been like the dopest, coolest experience, because now I know like in the future for sure I could double check someone's work and I'm like that's not right or like this is where we're having the most complications out here. So it's been cool, so thank you for that.

Speaker 1: 4:59

Yeah, I mean here's the other thing too is we're bootstrappers, right, it's like it's so you have to do what you guys actually have, and we talk about how valuable time is right, it's like. But what you actually have a little bit more of right now is time, right, so use it as the learning phase of your business. You know I think all you know like you guys are younger too and so, like all the it's better to get in business when you're younger, exactly so you have the time to work on your website, right, and so is that, like what's been the biggest surprise as far as something you thought was complex before getting into business, that actually was seemingly easy. Yeah.

Speaker 2: 5:34

I honestly I would say like dude, like that, all the like LLC, the EIN, the domain names, like you always get online or you might go to like YouTube University, what I call it, and like you see all these different people with all these different content saying, oh, you got to do this or you have to go through this service and this service and this service, and it's kind of overwhelming in a sense. And then when you sit down and like you actually just like get on, like the certain websites, either like the state website or the IRS website, it's honestly, very, very simple, very, very easy. So I think that, like today's society and I don't know, like what it may be or what it is, but they try to make it seem like this really big thing when honestly it took like my LLC and my EIN, like once I follow them, they took like 10 minutes each Like it's honestly so easy. Same thing with like the domain, like it's so easy, Go to go daddy and like literally it's like 10 minutes altogether. Took me like an hour to do all three of those things.

Speaker 1: 6:25

I think part of it is just overcoming the fear. Actually go take a peek at it. You know exactly.

Speaker 3: 6:29

And I think, even like with the website, like it was a lot harder than we expected and starting it, like we literally just opened up what the Wix app was, and then, like you can just start building it, like you think it's like you got to go through these hurdles and like jump through these walls and it's like no, like, like you said, once you get past the fear of starting, then you do realize like okay, now that you're actually in here clicking buttons, it's not that hard. It's a lot of work and it's tedious. But to get started, like you just got to go in there and click, because we notice that with the website and even like some of like the social media stuff, like it seems overwhelming, because we're like yo, we want to post this many times a day, we want to put out this much content, and now that we actually have like sat down and started recording and started filming, it's like, oh, it's actually not too bad, like it is work and it takes time to do it. But yeah, you just get going, you start. Once you get going, then it's like the ball starts rolling. You can continue that moment.

Speaker 2: 7:17

I think the biggest thing was that exactly. So, once we can get over the fear of actually just starting, we realized like, oh, like, this work isn't hard, it's just tedious. Oh yeah. I mean, and that's literally it.

Speaker 1: 7:26

Yeah, and you know that's eventually a point too, and like I want to make sure to like hit this point home, because we're talking about opportunity cost as well, it's like and we have to judge what your opportunity cost. When you're young and just starting in business, your opportunity cost is fairly low because, like let's, I'm not going to downplay what you guys can do. But let's say you can only go out and get a $20 an hour job, right, right, that's kind of your opportunity cost versus doing it. So if somebody's charging you more than that, then it's plus you have to equate something, and we don't do that. There's no X factor in opportunity cost formula for learning right or like the fulfillment of doing it or the confidence of doing it right, so you have to judge those things as well. It's like you guys see me do the landscaping around here. Is that worth my opportunity? No, no. You know like I make a heck of a lot more per hour than the landscaper that I could hire to do this right. But it's fulfilling to me to do it right and it keeps me honest, so to speak. You know doing that work, and so you have to judge those things in life too. You know like what that actual work is going to do.

Speaker 3: 8:26

And I think, seeing the way you guys moved into this building and I told Kai a lot about that to see you doing the plumbing and you it's what we moved in the summer, so it's like a hundred seven degrees, and I was out there just landscaping with the hat and you always had a smile on your face and it kind of showed me like to enjoy this part of the process because, like we're never going to be here again, we're never going to be at the bootstrap stage again, like once you get past this thing, like we talked about, it's like you talk about the good old days, like this is part of the process. You putting in the work, the long nights, the long hours, like in the moment it might not be as fun, but like we've made so many memories and we've only been doing this for a couple months or weeks, whatever it is, so it's like to be able to do this part, enjoy it like actually take pride in the fact that you're building your business yeah, building your brain, building your community Like this is something that we can take pride in and actually enjoy doing.

Speaker 2: 9:18

Yeah, I think like the biggest thing because we come from like basketball backgrounds as well when we were younger. But we used to always say, like you have to fall in love with the process.

Speaker 3: 9:27

Sure.

Speaker 2: 9:27

Because, like, if you don't fall in love with the process of it, then you get very tired, very easy, or it's like the same thing you go to the gym, right, like people suck at delay gratification for some reason, but like you're just not going to walk in and you're not going to hit a hundred abs today and then tomorrow have a six pack, right. So you have to fall in love with the process of working out. You have to fall in love with the process of, like, doing abs. And it's like the same thing with this, like, yeah, maybe tedious, maybe hard, maybe this and the third, but if you can fall in love with the process and you can fall in love with the hard work, oh man, it's like it truly allows you to have a better appreciation for not only what we do, but to see every other entrepreneur out there. Yeah, I mean because now we realize like I'm like, oh crap, like you done what? So far. I'm like oh man, so it makes me respect you and every other entrepreneur so much more as well.

Speaker 1: 10:10

That's you know, and that's where, like, I think that the education online, you know it kind of frustrates me because it's always like work on your business, you know, never in your business. You guys, when I'm out there doing the plumbing for the building, I'm working in the business, right? You know, I can hire a plumber very easily at this phase. I don't have to do the bootstrap stuff that I tell you guys to do but am I any good to you guys to help you if I'm not still doing some of the bootstrap stuff. I can appreciate every piece of the property that we've built out to, because I've did the bootstrap stuff. I actually think the best thing about where I'm at in life now is I have the time to still do the bootstrap stuff now when I start a new company, right? So I mean, I think that's part of the value. And then, like you, walk around and you see, I take a lot of pride in the place If I see a little of this scrap on the ground. You know it's like. I don't know if it would be possible to take near as much pride if I didn't have so much 125 degree sweat into it. Right, you know it's like, and so that's why I think there's there's a fine line. You know it's like. I think you start always by working in your business and I think eventually you progress to on your business and maybe sometimes that happens quicker, you know, but I think you should always have some some of that. It's like with my MBA program. It's like you're getting groomed, so to speak, to be CEO of a company, right? So what do they teach you? They teach you a broad scope of everything. You don't spend the entire two years working on finance. You spend a couple of semesters working on different types of finance, right, and it's like to know how to manage. You need to know at least a little bit about it, and I think that's kind of like what we've tried to help you guys with, right. And so eventually you're going to hire a social media guy. Eventually you're going to hire a web guy. But if you haven't ever done it, you can't manage it. Right, and not only that, but I think there's no better person in the world to do your social media, especially when you start, than you. It's just time, right. Time is the one tool you have a little bit of when you're first starting a business.

Speaker 3: 11:58

Exactly, and I think you hit it on the head too. It's the appreciation aspect of it, cause we talk about, like delay gratification and we've talked about this before too. If somebody just gives you something and gives you everything you want at one time, you don't appreciate it because you didn't have to put in the work for him, as opposed to you, like you appreciate this building because you were digging holes. You know what I'm saying? You were actually running the wires. If you would have just hired somebody to do it, yeah, it's still yours and you're still not appreciative of, like you said, every little inch of it. So now, with our business, like it's like these hats, like the social media pages it means so much more to us. Like the website, we have something that, like, we can show people I don't know the social media, the videos we're putting together because we did it. Now, if we would have just hired somebody, like, hey, you shoot it, you put it together, you put the website together, yeah, it's still ours and we still don't appreciate it as much as we would if we're doing what we're doing now, like actually building it up.

Speaker 2: 12:49

I think also, too, it allows you to be a walking testimony for whether it's your business or your brand, or whatever it may be, because if you're sitting there doing every single like little step, like step by step by step, that's all you're thinking about, right? So like whenever you talk to other people, that's what's on my mind, so I'm going to speak to you about these things. So, in essence, like I'm always talking about my brand because I'm always working on it and I'm working in it, so it's like I have nothing else. So now I become a walking testimony. So anytime I have a conversation whether it's an old woman in the grocery store or it's a CEO that I have no idea, that's a CEO but I'm talking to him about my brand, because this is all what's in my head right now.

Speaker 1: 13:24

So it's really, it's really big, Plus you can speak the lingo. It's like oh yeah, this week I was working on the SEO on my website, you know it's like, and we had a bear of a problem because one of the pages when it indexed properly. So, now you're speaking the lingo, you're immersed into your business, you're living it daily.

Speaker 3: 13:39

Exactly, and I think people can see that, like when I talk to people about the brand, when you talk to Kai and I about the brand, like you can see, this means a lot to us. And I've had people tell me, like man, like I could tell, like this really means a lot to you and I didn't realize that at the time, but it's like it's cause we're doing this part of it. Like, yeah, we're coming in here doing the podcast, we're doing the websites, the editing, the all that stuff. Like we're there for every step of the process. So I know how important this is and I can see how much work Kai has put in and vice versa, like we see how much we're pouring into this and then it just makes you appreciate it more and you speak Highly of it. You can see the glow in somebody, you can see it in their eyes, like when I talked to you about glaive or about the back lot or about easy pod, like you can tell you care Because you've been here doing the work. If you would have just hired a bunch of people, you might have not have that same fire, that same passion that same energy and people don't resonate the same if you don't have the energy. Yeah, you don't care about your business, how can you expect me to care about it?

Speaker 1: 14:32

Totally, you know, and that's I guess that's a fine line too, and I want to make sure to like Kind of circle back around on all that. It does get to a point where you should hire out people, right. But you know, like when we're talking about the bootstrap days, and then I'm fortunate enough, when I start companies, I have some time, you know now, and so I go back to the bootstrap days because that's what I love to do. You know, I like the initial foundation. I'm weirdo in the fact that I like the labor work still you know it's like and so like that's fulfilling to me, and one of the first things they tell service business people it's like they're out there working as a plumber for somebody right now. You know it's like it's gonna be one of the hardest switches for you when you go to working on your business, right. So you go out there, your your own person, you have a Soul proprietorship, you know, which I don't suggest actually you know, and so you have your own company. Yeah and and now you're doing everything in that company, right, you're having to learn how to do the taxes, you're doing the website, you're doing all these different things and at the same point You're doing the plumbing work. Right, but that's not forever. So eventually you get to the point where, okay, I'm gonna need some help here, you know it's like. So you have to give up part of it, you know. And then eventually what you give up part of is that daily labor, right. And then now you're working on your business more and more, which is okay, steering the strategy. You know Like managing all everything we talked about. You know like the marketers and the accountants, and now you're like working truly on your business, but you know everything that's going on with it too. That's the hardest phase, in my opinion, for a service person worker, big labor worker, because Trades worker, because now you're not working with these anymore. Yeah, you don't get to see the plumbing laid out anymore and that's fulfilling, right. You have to like see the air. You know it's tough for me. I'm working on my computer, I'm working, you know, but at the same time it's like I don't see the product of that. Yeah, I mean, I remember in my last company we got new, new paint booth and I was so excited about it. Or my first company, rather my friend, I'm so excited about it, you know. And so I'm back there with the guys and build the paint with that's. What I love to do is work with my guys, especially doing labor stuff like that, and the office manager comes out and she's like Tyler, you can't be Stuff's going on in the office, and you know it's like. So it is actually a hard line. Start working more and more on business.

Speaker 3: 16:45

And that's cool, too, that she mentioned that, because, like when we talk about, like you said, the bootstrap phase, like we are really in the beginning process, yeah we haven't even launched yet. And so it's like, like you said, we'll get to a point where, yeah, we'll start to move up and delegate things like that. And like I do think it's important, like you said, to draw that line like, yes, there's a point where you shouldn't be doing for sure everything once you're starting to scale up in the beginning, though, like it doesn't make sense not to and like you said to you just appreciate every role in the company now. You guys hit on it before. So now, when we do hire the social media person, not only can we give them a true vision of what we want to see you can also appreciate what they, what they do. So now I know how long it takes to put this clip together. Yeah, so the social media person comes back to me three days later on a video that should have took three hours, we know like no, we've done that video. It only takes 30 minutes. If you're really working or we've done that project, yes, it does take a week long to do it.

Speaker 1: 17:38

Well, and there's I. Unfortunately, there's so many shady people out there in the you know, merchant services game, in the Website game, in the social media game. That's not doing anything for your actual business. They're just charging you a bunch of money. Now you know effectively if that's working or not. Yeah, so I really want to hit home that. I think that's why it's important you know that we start in the bootstrapper phase, even if you're starting with some ton of money. You guys had some money saved up and things like that for business, but it's like, why spend the $15,000 on the website major? You burn the ship, so to speak. You quit the jobs, you know, and then you went all in on the business. It's like, okay, go all into the business. Yeah right, work on the website, you know. It's like save that $15,000, apply that to something you know that's gonna be more useful for the business, you know, and so. So, yeah, I'm proud of what you guys are doing. I'm curious like you guys intake Social media and stuff like that quite often. Yeah, what are you seeing online about business that like is completely different than like the Social media would have it be, and what the actuality was once you got into?

Speaker 2: 18:39

business man. I honestly I think it's almost like I would say like 98% of everything, yeah to be very honest like there is like, don't get me wrong, there are great people out there, there's great entrepreneurs, there's great people like you that give free game. That's actually useful, yeah, but I would say majority of what is online isn't useful, yeah. And just off the simple fact, like like one of them, I think two days ago I was on Instagram and they like oh well, like, all you gotta do is get a LLC, get a EIN, then you get 500,000 worth of Credit.

Speaker 3: 19:08

I'm not, yo what does?

Speaker 2: 19:09

this happen.

Speaker 3: 19:11

This isn't real. This isn't true, like how he's like in 30 days you have 500,000.

Speaker 2: 19:17

I'm like bro, like this just isn't realistic at all. I'm not yo, I have a LLC EIN.

Speaker 1: 19:23

Big account. This doesn't work like that, you know. Nor if you could get that money like what's the catch, why would you though?

Speaker 2: 19:31

What's the interest rate? You know?

Speaker 1: 19:32

it's like you're gonna get contacted the second you file like some of this paperwork.

Speaker 3: 19:36

You're gonna have every scam coming in the mail you know, it's like that's what we were talking about, yep.

Speaker 1: 19:40

Oh yeah, you guys get it. I'm sure the second you signed up for the EIN when you were registered. You know that LLC you're gonna start getting stuff in the mail.

Speaker 2: 19:47

That's like, if you don't submit this document with $500 right now, you're going directly to jail and yeah, yeah, I think the worst one is like the trademark man after we file the trademark. You know, our phones are just going crazy.

Speaker 3: 20:00

Yeah, I'm like oh my goodness, scans are getting legit, like they make you really worry because, like they put the right wording in the right letters and then obviously you can tell when something's not legit. But if you're just like going through the day and you see some pop up, you're kind of like, oh, like I need to take care of this, and so it's like it's important that we bring that up. That's like that's something else they don't talk about on social media. I think is the the in between parts, like it's like okay, file your LLC, file you and get 500,000. There's a lot of steps in between that they're like we're not talking about, and there's just so many examples of people are like oh yeah, you just open up your LLC, you get the credit and then you just start this business. That's a loaded sentence. Yeah start a business like okay, now we're talking about a website. Now it's time to SEO and I was almost like starting a business all the legal paperwork behind it, the tax implications they counting, like what accounting? Software you're using insurance, like there's so many things that in social media it's cool to see the end result, but this is the stuff that's dope, because they get to see the beginning like this. Isn't us sitting at the end of the journey Like, okay, this is what we did at the beginning?

Speaker 1: 21:01

No, yeah, we're doing right now yeah and some of it's not working.

Speaker 3: 21:04

And then we pivoted Okay, now this worked. Okay, now go into it. They're just skipping so many steps on social media and it, it, it makes people believe like, oh, I can do this in a week or two.

Speaker 1: 21:14

Yeah, just give 500,. You know just do this, get the credit cards, and now you're getting business credit cards.

Speaker 3: 21:19

Yeah, doing all this stuff and it's like we don't know the in-between steps of what they're doing day to day in between those to make that possible.

Speaker 2: 21:26

And especially to. It's like dude, as soon as you do get like a LSE, yeah, and big count, and if you even want to go apply for credit, like if you have no money in your account, whatever, there are some place, like some cards, that you can like put money in your account and then they go base off the money in your account. Yeah, but majority of it is like it's going to be personally guaranteed. Yeah, like, with it being personally guaranteed, it's pulling straight from your credit. So if you do fall on that card or this and the third, it goes directly to you. Like it doesn't go, it doesn't default to the business. No, so like if you did 500,000 defaults to you.

Speaker 1: 22:01

It takes a lot of times to Establish business credit to where you know like you can separate those things. But then, even still, it's like Well, what's the plan for the business? The plan for the business is just just scam out $500,000, you know so like you can get a car in a house and like or you could be building a sustainable business. You know it's like I don't understand that right.

Speaker 3: 22:20

It's weird too, and especially with like different stuff. Like I was watching this guy on, I Don't remember it's just something that popped up on a reel. It's like oh, you want to put out like three pieces of content a day, like five pieces of content a day, and I'm like that's cool. But what he's not mentioning is like what setting should I export in so my video has higher quality? Because he's talking about like okay, like we'd higher quality videos. Like on social media there's just a lot of stuff that people are posting like hey, do this, do this, and then not giving the background of how to do it. So it's like okay, like yeah, you're saying, post these videos. What are you recording on? Are you recording on your phone? Is it a camera? Are you recording in cap cut? Are you editing on your phone or a laptop? What laptop do you use to edit? Which one should I get? Like there's so many things that, like people are giving out a lot of information that's not as helpful as they think, because it's not backed by the other stuff that needs to be there very rarely If you look at most of it.

Speaker 1: 23:08

So for my lens, you know I look at a lot of it to these days and very rarely is it provable right. They like to work in the unprovable. You know, like this is how you should feel about something. This is what you should do, working, you know, on the business. You know from the very start of it, you know the things like that, so they dwell in those systems. You know, and then it tells me that, like there, it's not real good information. I see very few people talking about accounting. I mean number one, it's it's not popular, right, that's why my videos aren't more popular. But number two, it's like it's not glamorous and you have to know it really well to talk about how it's usable, right, it's like there's a great South Park episodes. It's like the underpants, gnomes, and they're like step one, steel underpants, step three, profit, right, and then like I feel like that's like a lot of what's online. It's like we've missed step two, which.

Speaker 3: 23:58

That's exactly it, and it's like you talk about a lot of stuff that's just on social media. That's very specific to one person.

Speaker 2: 24:05

Yeah, well, I would say, not even just very specific to one person, but it could be just that business, because I think that every single business is different. And until you actually start getting into your business and working in it and working on it, yeah, you're not gonna realize, like what steps you have to take next. And I think that's the biggest thing, because each business or each person, how they run their business, is so different that, like this may work for you but it might not work for me. Yeah, so you have to get into your business, you have to start working on, you have to start working in it to even see some of the next steps. So a lot of stuff that we see online they're like do this this, this, this well? Like that doesn't even apply to my business. So like, how do I even do that? You know, and I think that's something that's really big. For a lot of people out there is like, once you guys start trying, or you guys Start working in your business and on your business, that's when they're gonna be able to see those next steps or like well, actually you can apply versus what you can apply.

Speaker 1: 24:52

Exactly. And the part that you guys haven't gotten to, which is the hardest part, is when you have to have employees right, because you can't do it on your own forever, yeah, and that's where the inverses on jump back and forth, and I don't know why more people don't talk about this, because you have To work in both right, even when you are at the high up. But, head honcho, I think you still got to be back working in a little bit. You know, I like I gave you guys the paint booth analogy that builds a lot of crom rotti with my staff. I'm out there working that job, yes, right. Or, you know, we used to take turns in cleaning an employee bathroom, including me, you know. It's like I was CEO of a company that, like, was huge, you know, and at the same time I had guys that made over a hundred thousand dollars a year on paying them to clean the bathroom with me. You know, but what's that culture? Work for sure. What's that? Work, ethic, work, yeah, what is? You know? I can't respect a boss that's not gonna show up before me, that's not gonna work hard, that hasn't been there, that gives me crap jobs that they would never do. No way you got to jump back and forth a little bit, in my opinion right so. I mean, I mean I think even if you're ahead of Facebook right now, you know how, you know they have that undercover boss show where they go out and they work with the people and things like that. It's like how rewarding is it if you have your boss jump back? So let's say you're the CEO of Facebook, how rewarding would it be at any level to have the boss all of a sudden come in and work with you? You know, and not only that, but you learn things on that level. I mean that undercover boss shows shows it pretty well. Yeah, it's like you can learn, in essence, from those people that you're working with on any level of your company. You know, there's a idea calls it's an interdisciplinary thinking, and Boeing started to embrace it and basically they started to bring in the guy that was like literally turning the nut, you know, on the plane every day with the engineers, because I worked with a lot of engineers. We used to do Manufacturing for new vehicle manufacturers all run and I would work with them a lot, because what worked on paper didn't always work in Practicality right, and so, like Boeing found that out too, it's like if the guy moved the bolt back five feet, it's saved him this in his job, you know. And not only that, but they turned out to be strong. I'm telling murdering the story, but you guys get the point. It's like if you can have everybody involved on every level, which means moving around through your business.

Speaker 3: 26:57

Exactly. And that's huge too because, like we said, we have sports backgrounds and one thing that if you're a coach and you're a trainer and you're trying to tell me to do something that you can't do, yeah, it was always hard for us to believe that, like sure had some assistant coaches on our team who would tell us to do certain things. We knew that they've done those before. So it's like okay, you need to make this many jumpers today, why? No, you've done that and that's how you got to where you're at, so I'm gonna do it. Vice versa, you're a trainer and you're overweight and you're telling me to do this or do that. It's gonna be hard for me to listen to you. Same thing, those guys seeing you at the top of the company come down and wipe a toilet down. Yeah, there's no excuses. Now I can't be like oh, I'm too good for this, because the dude who hired the dude who hired me, who hired me is doing it. So it's like I have no, no excuse. I got to go in there and do it because he's doing it too. It almost puts like a like a good peer pressure in a sort of sense. Like people feel like alright, if he can do it. There's no reason I can't you know it.

Speaker 1: 27:50

Actually there's a good story around that too that I heard later. And so basically we had a new manager come in and one of the other managers higher-up managers said hey, you're not doing anything, can you sweep the floor in your area or whatever? And the guys like I'm a manager, I'm not gonna sweep the floor. And then he goes oh Well, if the boss can clean the restroom, I'm pretty sure you can sleep the floor around here.

Speaker 3: 28:10

Exactly yep.

Speaker 1: 28:11

It's, like you know, and there's a lot of people out there that will disagree with me completely on this whole conversation that we're having, you know. But here's the thing I guarantee they didn't start with $0, or a couple grand and build businesses. Right, it's not the same. We can't call these things the same. We can't call Facebook the same as you guys starting your business, we can't call Tyler's first company, you know, with nobody to help and a couple grand to start it. That's not the same. You know, if I would have just sat back and said I'm only gonna work on my business, you know I'm not gonna. I'm too good to work on a website, I'm too good to do the social media Then guess where I would have went. Nowhere, right? I mean, we're really teaching people right now the bootstripper mentality, right, the underdog mentality, but this is actually what leads to a game changer, right? Right, you know it's like. So, yes, of course, if you start with millions and millions of dollars, you might never have to touch your website, right? Exactly, if you have like luck and you go out there and pitch your idea and somebody buys off on it, you can hire that guy. Maybe that minor, but I hired the web, but we're not talking about that world. That is a 1% if that of the world right, exactly. And that's why you know you'll have people out there, they'll probably take this video, they'll dice it all up and say like how stupid this is. And it's like well, let's talk about where you started, right, because we're completely different areas.

Speaker 3: 29:24

Exactly. And then it's like, even to go back to the social media thing, it all ties in because it's like now, let's say, I'm watching this Instagram reel and I've got $400 to start this business. I'm watching a guy give me steps who had 400,000 to start his business. So the stuff he's doing I literally can't do. No, I can't go out and buy this, I can't go out and hire that. So that's what's tough, especially with like, like we said, every business is different. This is different than that. The bootstrappers these are the people that you need to listen to. If you're a bootstrapper, if you got $100,000 to start your business, you don't need to talk to me. You don't need to talk to somebody who started their business, who had that money and knows where to invest and things like that Find where your business works and operate in that area.

Speaker 1: 30:07

I would say yes to a certain extent, but doing it this way will still teach them way more Right right so. I would say. So. Let's say you're gonna go out and your dad is the head of this major, major company, you know, and you're a groom to take it over someday. Are you gonna learn more working about on your dad every day? Or, if I was the dad, I'd make them start at the very base level, work their way up through the company and I'd be teaching them on the side at the same time. This is why this step in your job was valuable. This is what you learned from that right. And so still, I think you can always go back to bootstrap and mentality you know like. But here's the thing it's like you put in some of these big business people tomorrow into a small business. They fail. I promise you Now we could go out there and take a couple scrappy bootstrapers and put them in a big company. I guarantee we'd see a difference. They'll figure it out.

Speaker 2: 30:54

Yeah, make it happen, for sure.

Speaker 3: 30:56

Make some shake. We gonna make some shake.

Speaker 2: 30:58

I used to be our saying. We worked for a really big Fortune 500 company and we used to always tell people like, yeah, we don't know what we're doing, but I guarantee we're gonna make something shake. Yeah, because at the end of the day, by any, we're going to figure out. It doesn't matter how long it's gonna take, like, if we don't have the answer to it, we're gonna find somebody that has an answer to it. Yeah, and that was our biggest thing and I think that's honestly what gave us a lot of success, even in this business. Now it's like the mentality of by any means, like we're going to figure this out and we're going to make it work. So if that is us being on Google for 20 hours trying to figure out one thing, cool, let's do it. You know what I mean. If it's sitting there giving you a phone call or giving somebody else a phone call to sit here and ask a question, let's do it. And if it's like even last night, you'd kind of be proud of us, right? So we filmed our first like pod episode and then we're trying to figure out how to sit there and edit it. No idea, it took us two and a half hours to even get to like a bare minimum of it. And then we gave Martin a phone call. Can you please help us walk. Five minutes later it was done. But like literally, by any means, if you could just have, especially if you're bootstrapping a company, if you just have the mentality by any means necessary, you're going to get it done. Man, it's game changing.

Speaker 1: 32:08

I mean, even if you get the big loan off the bat, it's like you won't use it right if you're out taking this mindset towards it. It's like I told this story in episode two, but it's relevant here too. It's like there's a guy that wanted to get in the belt business, right, Making these kind of belts for your pants, and the machine was like $100,000. You know, and so he didn't have the $100,000, or, let's say, he could go out and get a loan for $50,000 of it or whatever. You know it's like okay, maybe he gets the 100 and he's spending that on the belt and then there's no room for anything else. But instead he went out there and he's like we looked at the machine, went to Home Depot, bought $10,000 worth of stuff and built even a better machine, and that's actually the machine that's used in the marketplace now. Right, and so, like I think that's the mentality you got to take towards a lot of this stuff. That's why it's important to work into it right, Because you guys might see something along your website journey, your social media journey, something else that's gonna allow you to innovate in that 100%.

Speaker 2: 33:02

And I think something else that's like really big is something that we try to do as well. It's like, okay, we'll set a budget for something and then, like, we try to cut it in half and like, okay, let's try to work with this. Like if we can make it work with half of what we budgeted it out for, overgo it and because now we can use that in so many different aspects. But I do believe again, if you do start off with like a lot of money, then you in a sense you're like, okay, well, I have money to waste.

Speaker 1: 33:24

You buy yourself out of problems, exactly.

Speaker 2: 33:26

So it's more so like okay, well, I could afford to fail on this. Yeah, you know, instead of just sitting there and just like, oh well, if I only have $1,000, like I only have $1,000. So like I have to put in the work to make sure that this $1,000 works and you'll always figure it out.

Speaker 1: 33:40

And the thing is, too, is like you see these heavily funded startups come out, you know, and what do they do? They spend hundreds of thousands of dollars on the fancy furniture, the fancy artwork, you know they never even have a customer come into place. What sense does that make? You know it makes zero sense. You know, it's like that initial, like startup capital is the first big hurdle in my well, the first big hurdle is eventually getting to making money. But the first big one is like when you eventually pay that money back. Now you have basically a successful business that's producing money and then also has paid back the startup cost right. And so, like, you want to make that initial hurdle as small as possible not 500,000, you know and so it's taken years to get to the point where you should or shouldn't have done the business right. So, because that's what you always have to weigh, what's my opportunity cost For sure, Go ahead, sorry. One of the biggest things in starting a business in one. I didn't all these lessons. I learned the hard way, right. And that's why I try to help. We try to help here, you know, do what we do and but one of them was opportunity cost once again, but opportunity cost in the business that you don't start.

Speaker 2: 34:45

That's good.

Speaker 1: 34:46

So that's why I tell people all the time you really want to analyze your business that you're going to start because your biggest opportunity is the one you don't start. Screw what you're doing with your time, otherwise you know it's like what's the business that you didn't start Because then when you get some success in a business, you know and that's going along, you're going to have a hard time, like getting out of a business right, it takes a little while to sell it and then not only that, but your first baby. It's hard to sell your first baby, right. B business could have been better business in every single way. You know it's like and then worth more of your opportunity, but it takes almost some time we're actually listening to people that have been there already to understand that. So, I always assess every business I'm going to go into. I have to think about the ones I'm not starting. That's good, the ones I'm not going into.

Speaker 2: 35:29

I, until you brought that up to me, I had never even thought about that and, honestly, it's probably like one of the biggest negates that I've taken away, because it is so true and it's actually really huge, and I think, something that a lot of people because we are in today's age where everybody wants to be an entrepreneur and everybody wants to like not working nine to five and all this stuff and we see people like they get one idea and right away, like they're just full blown in on it, instead of like really sending down and evaluating. My thing is to, even before you get to the part of boot shopping, like really sit down and look at your business plan and like really figure out, do all the research that you possibly can before you go and start that business. Like you can even start taking steps. Okay, well, like, if I'm going to go build this website, what are the steps that I have to do, what are the things that I have to be here? And if I'm going to sit here and even create hats or create a shirt, like, okay, well, like, who are the manufacturers? Can I get manufacturers overseas? And all these different things, because that will also allow you to sit there and look at the opportunity costs of it, because there's so many other businesses out there that you could really, if you take that same amount of effort and the same amount of time, you can, instead of like taking these many steps, you can sit here and take this many steps.

Speaker 1: 36:33

Yeah Well, what was the one of the first things that I told you guys too? Yeah, you're like, don't do it. Well, other than that, you know, I wanted you to test the idea.

Speaker 3: 36:41

for sure, for sure, for sure.

Speaker 1: 36:43

And I wanted you to seriously think that you were getting in the right business At the end. My job is just to make you. I'm supposed to poke holes in it Absolutely, and then test your desire to go towards that business. But I also told you you got a plan for the success of the business too. It's like hey, what's the backup plan if you guys hit the home run out of the park tomorrow? Right Businesses fail that way too.

Speaker 3: 37:04

That was big Cause. I remember you looked at us and you were like, okay, so like we're going to do it, because we had the meeting and we sat down. You're like, all right, we're going to do it. So you're like, okay, what if Jay-Z gets a hold of the hat wears on a concert? Now, you've got 15,000 orders tomorrow. And we looked at each other. We're like, well, we're screwed, like we don't have nothing. That night we went home, found a manufacturer, different things like that, and I think it's important, especially when we talk about, like, the steps of a business, like you said, before you get to the bootstrapper stage. Okay, we want to sell hats. That's the first thing we're going to sell. What do we need to sell hats? We need hats. We need vinyl to put the design on the hats. We need someone, we need a manufacturer for the hats. You got to worry about shipping. How much are they going to cost? How much does it cost us? Like, sit down and like, when we talk about how a business plan go through, okay, I want to start fixing cars. Well, what do I need? Bare minimum to start fixing cars and then that can. That helped us a lot with the opportunity cost To where we know now, okay, like this is all we need, bare minimum to get started. Okay, we can do that Now. If we were to start the business, it would have been like, okay, we need this, this and this, this and this. Then you can judge which one might be better to start now, start later. Different things like that.

Speaker 1: 38:03

Well, and you can use numbers and luckily, kai, you like numbers, you know. Thank God you can be like some. I mean, and those of you out there that don't like numbers. You know I was not a person that loved them. I don't think at first, but now I do. I'm the biggest nerd for numbers because it gives you a crystal ball for what you're doing. I mean, I have a whole thing that I've developed now because I realize every entrepreneur out there is not going to do an 85 page business plan. You know, glaive has an 85 page business plan. I've written a lot of business plans, right, but in general most people aren't going to do it. Joe the plumber that's out there looking to start his first plumbing business, he is not going to do an 85 page business plan. So I actually I've disseminated it down to a plan for business. I've actually called it now testing an opportunity. So basically it's a fill in the blank sheet that does the same thing, and if your business doesn't work in the sheet, then guess what you got to go back to the drawing board because I can tell you one of the biggest things I ever learned in helping a lot of people is most of the businesses didn't work on paper, so why would you even start it in that way? I'm not saying don't just start it and you can't like get lost in that forever, but you should at least write it down right, and then like okay, what's this? Go out there and play house. I always tell people, like, what is this product going to cost me? Right? What can I sell it for in the marketplace? If my price has to be higher than the market, what is my reasoning for that? Right, if you're going out to start a hamburger store tomorrow, go out and have a couple of hamburgers around town in the same area that you're going to be in. What are they charging? What are they doing right? What are they doing wrong? You're going to charge $50 for your hamburger. Tell me where you're going to build that extra $30 in value. I'm not saying you can't do it.

Speaker 2: 39:39

For sure.

Speaker 1: 39:39

Just tell me where you're going to build that extra $30 in value. That's huge and I think also too really fast.

Speaker 2: 39:45

Is that and I know that we're talking about business in the second to third Dude people don't realize that you can, before you actually go do the LOC, the EIN, and make it a true business, you can go and test your products, yeah, like I can go get a hat made just this hat alone, and I can go down the street and ask people if they even like it or if somebody wants to purchase it or wear it around I told you to do, I'm pretty sure, and we did it, and we did it, and I'm like, have you even been?

Speaker 1: 40:09

wearing it around, yeah.

Speaker 2: 40:11

And as soon as we did it, we realized oh no, there's something here, yeah. And it's the same thing with the hamburgers. Of course, technically you would need a license to go out and be a vendor or the center, but if you really just have like five, 10 burgers and you really just walked around town trying to sell your burger, like you could. And you can actually see if there's a want or a need there.

Speaker 1: 40:33

There's always a way to tiptoe into it, and that's why it's always a fine line, because a lot of this stuff you can't get stuck so long that you don't get started, because a lot of the best businesses become pivots anyways. And that's a whole never conversation to be able to watch for the pivot. But you eventually have to get started. But I don't know why not start smart. Make sure it works on paper first. Make sure you set up your vendors, make sure you're doing all these different things. If it doesn't work in this world, then you got to tweak somebody, something.

Speaker 3: 41:01

Exactly, and I feel like competition, even going on what Kai's talking about, the competition in your market can be your best friend's start. Now. We had a very specific, a very niche brand. So we're starting off selling Christian Apparel. So, ok, cool, who's selling Christian Apparel? Ok, cool. What are their prices? Where are they doing this? You can go on their website. You can find out. Ok, how are they doing this? How are they doing that? Not copying, but just looking at the market and evaluating what's going on in the market. Are they actually able to move these clothes? If you're doing the burgers like, ok, like you said, go to these other burger stands. You know what grills are they using, what's the process that they're doing? Where are they getting the food from? You can look at these other businesses and then start to decide OK, this is the blueprint. This can be a game plan.

Speaker 1: 41:42

That is where it comes. Step two right. Step one steal underpants. Step two do this right. Step three profit. And so it's like the other day, somebody approached me. They have a spot of land that they can get from a family member, but the family member wants to see a business plan and they're like, oh well, we're just going to do a storage place right. And so it's like, well, ok, storage place. Millions of different ways to do a storage place right. And so now you've got to do the research. Ok, what storage places are there around there? Are we talking cars? Are we talking semi trucks? Are we talking, ok, what does it cost to build a building on there? And then do storage units for materials right? These are different businesses. You should assess all this on paperwork, see what the market is in the area, call around, see if there's storage units available, do everything you can before you eventually roll the dice. It's like gambling in a way right? Eventually you've got to roll the dice. But, imagine if you could do all kinds of research before you ever rolled the dice right. It's like you could test the wind temperature, and it's going to be hard to come up with a lot of variables. You know what I mean, but imagine if you had time to test all these variables first. That's what planning a business is. Go out and make these phone calls.

Speaker 3: 42:51

there's no reason not to Other than pure laziness, exactly, and it's like when you talk about making a gamble or like placing a bet, like if, like, let's say, you're in a sports betting, we see all these people who win off, like the parlays, like the big gambles. We don't see the hours of research they did in between that. So it's like, okay, you're gonna make a gamble, why? No, this team doesn't shoot well during this time of the season. He's having a slow streak. Build up like do the research? Build up the before. You just go in there and just gamble everything away Like do the research for it.

Speaker 1: 43:19

That's what's so tough cause there's two types of individuals we could talk to right now. There's the one that's just gonna start, right and like I honestly think you gotta just start at some point. I'd actually rather them not plan at all and just get started. But it's like, why not plan? And I say that very begrudgingly because you guys know I think you should plan the business. But you can't get so lost in never starting either Because yeah, if you never throw the dart, you never hit it right. And so, and there's so much you learn in the initial phases of the business, or even, like we're talking, you're like building the website, putting these things together there's so much you're gonna learn. You might even right now, while you're doing these things, you could be learning about your next business.

Speaker 2: 43:56

Right, absolutely.

Speaker 1: 43:57

You know, or like you'll see something you like, call and get frustrated by something. You know it's like that happens to me all the time. I get frustrated by something and that becomes a business formation, right and my daily interactions. You know it's like, hey, this is the people that are doing this. This is horribly done, right. You know, kind of back to the. You know the stuff that we do these days with Glaive. It's like I don't think anybody's being helpful in this. I don't think anybody's doing a good job at it. I don't think anybody's educating the people in it that are. There's some people out there like Mark Randolph, the founder of Netflix. He's out there giving great information. He does it for free. Problem is it's a little bit different world, you know, and so like I take some decent stuff from it, but it's hard for bootstrapers to take some of it, you know, because it's completely heavily funded off the start you know Netflix and that sort of stuff. You know it's like it's a different world, but I just, you know, I feel like there's not enough good information out there for people.

Speaker 2: 44:52

Exactly, I think my biggest thing, too, with like bootstrapers is like my biggest thing would be to get started, because I think that, like, as soon as you get started, like then you take that first step, that first step is gonna show you what the next step has to be, and so forth. Right, and then also too, as well, like as a bootstraper, I feel like even just as an entrepreneur in general, you should be extremely curious, you know, and like you should don't weigh your pride, you know, because, like even the very first time I ever met you, like we sat there, we had a conversation, you were a dope dude I feel like we found like mutual ground right and then from there I asked you that same exact day hey, can I have your number and are you okay if I give you a phone call if I run into any trouble? as far as, like me starting my business, and I think a lot of people, especially at this stage in age, like we have a pride problem with like not going out and asking for help, you know. Or if you do have a conversation with somebody that has done something before you, like throw your pride away, man, and just ask that question, even if it sounds stupid. We always say like there's no dumb questions because, like, if you don't know the answers to that question, how is it dumb? You know, like you need an answer, so like, why not, if you, if you could find somebody out there in the world that has like done it before you or this, that.

Speaker 3: 46:00

And the third, like please ask them those questions because, like just us asking you guys questions have literally eliminated, bro, at least like 10, 15 steps for us you know, and it's like I think that's another thing to bounce off of that when we talk about like social media and things like that, no one does anything by themselves. So, it's like, a lot of times we're afraid to like oh, I want to build it on me. You know, I want to build this by myself. I want to say it was all me. That's not a real thing. Like people still bounce ideas off, even if it's something simple, like I said. Like, oh, we see, you've built businesses. We're trying to build the business. Okay, we might have a couple of questions. Do something like there's always someone in the business that you can ask questions to and that will be willing to help. Like it's like. And even if they're not, we could have reached out to somebody and be like hey, like yo, we see you started the brand. They could have never responded yeah, perfect, I've done that a bunch. There's been so many people that I've reached out to that. Don't even open the message. People are that literally just be like hey, bro, no, like you know, like we're cool off that, which is perfect. But when you find the one person that's willing to help, it can change everything. Like, even if it's just one conversation. I've had a conversation a couple of days ago with the dude who started business that changed the way I was thinking about all of it in a good way, because it's just a different perspective. Even if you have that conversation and you don't take anything from it, you're like actually no, I didn't want, you still got a different perspective to look at it. That's the biggest thing you gave us was just another way to look at the business that we just weren't seeing before.

Speaker 1: 47:22

Yeah, and you know, it's only years and years of heartache that give you that lens to be able to do that right, and so that's why I feel it's a blessing to be able to do it. You know, it's like because that took a lot of pain, you know, to learn and that took a lot of doing it the wrong way, and that's why, you know, it gets frustrating for me. Sometimes I'm like I'm telling you, you know, not with you guys, but with some people. I'm telling you, don't do it this way, you know, but some people still have to, you know, touch the fire. You know, like, no matter what you tell them, they're not going to listen. They still have to touch the fire, you know, and that's you know. But all you can do is all you can do with it.

Speaker 2: 47:53

Absolutely. I kind of have a hot take. It's kind of the bounce off of what you said. I truly don't believe that like there's such thing as self-made millionaire.

Speaker 3: 48:02

It's not a real thing.

Speaker 2: 48:03

It's not a real thing, even if, like you, literally boost a chapter company from the ground up and you scaled it up to a million dollars, like there, to me I feel like like that's ignorant you know, because along the way you had help somewhere. So in my eyes there's just no such thing as a self-made anything in life, because at some point in time somebody helped you along the way.

Speaker 1: 48:23

We have in this world. Some people get bigger bowls of resources, some people get smaller bowls than resources, some people get incredibly small bowls of resources. But anytime, especially for business people, you know that really anything in the world, it's like somebody has to take out of their bowl and put it into yours, right? So there's no true self-made, I don't care who you are, it's not a real thing, because they have to buy from your businesses, they have to spend time with you, you know. It's like. It's like so to be self-made doesn't exist. You know I started my business, couple grand, living in a dirt lot. I'm not self-made. People bought from my business, right, I had employees along the way that helped me. You know Like I had. You know like it wasn't. You know it's not just you in this world, right, people have to take some of their bowl.

Speaker 2: 49:09

And you know, we you hit on it a little bit earlier, but we are younger and I do think that in our generation we see that a lot, that like they want to be self-made, because they see that all over the internet. They see it all over Instagram, this and that and again, like I'm here to tell you guys, like that's not a real thing. Like please slow away your pride, because a lot of I see a lot of these young kids like, since they hear like self-made, oh, I want to be self-made, so they want to do everything on their own. And that's where the pride kicks in, of like not asking questions or not asking for help.

Speaker 1: 49:36

It's crazy though. It's like they want to be self-made, but then they're looking for the LLC scam that gets them $500,000. It's like I mean, we have to chalk it up to. You know, like it, we have to start somewhere right. And then it's like you ask Jeff Bezos right now, but, like, be proud of where you start. You guys, be proud of where you have to. You know, I promise you the win is going to be the greatest win on earth. You know, like, like we talked, it's not true self-made, right, nobody's truly self-made, but it will be done yourself, right, we could say it's done yourself, and it will feel that much better, I guarantee. If you were to put Bezos in a room and you ask him what is one thing you could take back in this world, it would be probably the initial loan from his family. I got Amazon started Because, no matter how big Bezos gets, he's always going to have people saying he initially got funded by his family.

Speaker 2: 50:26

Credibility.

Speaker 1: 50:27

And that's always going to take away something from him, Right? So so I'd be proud of you starting from nothing, right? Be, proud of that fact because I guarantee the win is going to be that much better. You know, like it's oh no, go ahead, my bad, it's going to be a harder route, right, you don't have the rich uncle, you know, or you can stop by Glaive. We'll act like a, we'll act like the uncle that you need to help you with your business. You know there's no problem there. But you know, like that's why I think that, like you need more of Glaive, because it's not the money People all think it's the money. It's not the money, it's the education, it's the 10 years of getting your butt kicked right To have to learn this stuff. You know it's like by talking to you, guys, I save you the 10, 15 year butt kicking, I promise you. You know At least the first couple of years, you know. And so, like I would say, if somebody's going out there and they've started looking for some people that started on a similar road to what you're starting on, right, and then you have to look at that and you have to like, listen to them, and what they're saying is not going to be popular, for sure it's not going to be. Hey, guys, don't spend money on your website. Go out there, and now I want you to spend a month building your website out, you know, but that's not going to be the fun route. But is it the better route? I think wholeheartedly, given your scenario, absolutely.

Speaker 2: 51:39

I also think that's huge because in a sense, like whenever I talk to young because I do like high school ministry a lot and whenever I talk to these young kids and they want to be entrepreneurs, they're saying third, I try to talk them out of their business, because if I can sit there and talk to you out of your business, this isn't the business period.

Speaker 3: 51:54

You don't need to be doing it no, yeah, yeah, yeah.

Speaker 2: 51:55

So I always try that. My biggest thing is if somebody could talk you out of your business by how much work it's going to be. Think about something else, you will never fail if you don't quit.

Speaker 1: 52:05

I'm positive of it. 70% of businesses fail because people quit. That's great, and the reason that number is increasing is because they're being sold online, that you get to work your own hours, that you get to make money after hand over fist right away Travel vacation and then they're set up for failure right. Your business will work if you don't quit. I'm positive of it and that's why I'm all about finding something that is passionate for you, is a part of your life plan, is a part of that next step in your journey that's going to be to your eventual greatness or whatever that's going to be, and that could be opening your landscaping company tomorrow because you can start with the lawnmower right. And then you build that landscaping company and learn a lot of business lessons along the way, doing everything. We're talking about bootstrapping it. You sell it in two, three years. Now you got your nest egg where you can go out and you start a little bit loftier business, right? Exactly so much like the guy in the last episode, starts out with the lawnmower, sells his company for $10 million.

Speaker 3: 53:04

It's wild, it's ridiculous.

Speaker 1: 53:05

Now he got to start anything he wanted, which was a tech company right.

Speaker 3: 53:09

Yeah, so, and I mean it's like I know, like you touched on it like the fail and the failing like to be a failure. The only way to be a failure is to give up. I heard a quote. It's like the only difference between failing and failure is giving up. If you don't give up, you can't be a failure. I always give people the analogy we're big into sports. It's like you. Look at Steph Curry, one of the best shooters to ever play a sport of basketball. I think he shoots like 40 something percent the best, yeah, the best Like and you can argue if you want to. In my opinion, he's the best. He's missed more shots than he's made. Why isn't he considered a failure though? Yeah, because he never stopped shooting. He's going to keep shooting. The only reason we're sitting on this couch here is because of the fails that we've made. Yeah, it's been a lot of them, and those lead to the wins. So it's like you're going to have stumbles. You're going to fail. If you don't give up, though, you're not a failure. Those failures lead to all these people. They talk about Bezos, the business that he has now, the Amazon, things like that. He started tens of businesses before that. All of them failed. If he would have stopped before Amazon, now he's a failure. He kept going. So now those aren't failures, that he just failed at that part, learned from it and kept moving forward, and now he's got to win.

Speaker 1: 54:15

Not only that, but you look at how many companies they bought along the way. That ended up being massive failures, right?

Speaker 3: 54:20

Just tear like no chance of succeeding, and it's like those lead to the Amazon. You have to go through the fails at first, the mistakes, the missteps, in order to get to the success. It's rare that you start something one time. Start your first business and it's just a big success. You got to go through the different steps to get to there.

Speaker 1: 54:39

That's why the best business advice on the planet is Rocky. It's like keep going forward and taking punches. Nobody's going to hit as hard, Just got to keep going forward, and that is business. That is absolutely business. But that's not the popular message online. What sells a course is going to be here's how you make $50,000 tomorrow, right? Ok, buy six LLCs or, excuse me, have six LLCs and then you're going to be a millionaire somehow. I'd love to know how that one works being a place out. All I see is a problem with the IRS.

Speaker 2: 55:13

I don't want that.

Speaker 1: 55:15

Absolutely not. We're drawing towards the end of this episode and I really want to get out there in the world. What are the things you guys have been on this journey now? For what?

Speaker 3: 55:26

six months.

Speaker 1: 55:28

What are the things that initially you were so afraid of before starting it? What were some things that out there in the audience. If you're thinking about opening a business, these are the things you're afraid of and how you kind of dealt with those.

Speaker 2: 55:41

I mean, honestly, if I could just be very transparent. Mine was just starting Because I walked away from a job that was a six-figure job and it was just how the world would look at me. So it wasn't necessarily the actual work, but trying to get over the fear of looking at myself and having other people look at me as a failure. So I really had to just kind of throw away the outside opinion, and what really helped me with that was OK, Kyle, well, one day you're going to have a wife and you're going to have children. What else is going to matter in the world at that point in time. So if your future spouse and your future children would be proud of you for taking this step now, why would you care about everybody else in the world? That's good so really limiting the fear of what other people think about me and just taking those steps, and that's honestly what even allowed me to begin to even have the struggles of figuring out the different intricacies of business. So really just throwing away the outside opinion and really just focusing on your life, because, at the end of the day, you have to wake up every single day, you have to look yourself in the mirror every single day and be OK with what it is that you're doing and what it is that you see in the mirror, and once I could just focus on that and just focus on my family and myself and not the whole entire world. That's when I began to take the steps and really walked away from the job and started this business. That's huge.

Speaker 3: 57:05

I think for me it was more of kind of like an imposter syndrome thing, Because we talked about both of us doing stuff like this, like being in front of the public eye, and for a while, when we first started, I just didn't see myself as somebody who could provide a lot of value to a lot of people, and I think that's where a lot of us sit. It is like we just don't think like me, like you know what I'm saying, I see this guy on social media, this girl on social media. That's not me, you know what I'm saying. And I think one thing that really helped me was I sat down with somebody from our church and he was like everyone has value to provide because you can do something that no one else on this planet can do, and that's be you. So it's like I can do something that no one else can, could or will ever be able to do, and that's be me, that's be us and that's attack this, the way that we can do it. And so I think a lot of it was just dealing with that imposter syndrome and getting over the fact that you do have value to provide. Whether it's you think it's small, you think it's big. There's value that you can give and, like you said, you find the niche and you find the spot where you can give that value and just talk about the stuff you know. Don't put too much pressure on, like starting a podcast. I got to be expert in this, expert in that so I promise you I'm not, but it's like I know the stuff. I do know and I know me and I know that me being who I am can be the value that I can provide to people. And I think once we started to figure that out, it's easier for us now to be in front of the public eye, to do things like this and to actually sit down and give our opinions, or give the not even opinions give our experiences, the things that we're going through. It's not like whether it's a factor opinion. This is what's happening and this is what happened. This is what we've learned. That's value that we could give out.

Speaker 1: 58:45

You know and that's what's interesting for me too is like so mostly when you do podcasts, you know we're pretty involved with that community here. You know, it's like you're going out and you're trying to get experts on different things and bring them into the room and we forget how much can be learned from somebody just starting, and that's a big reason why I want it. I think there's going to be more value perceived out of this episode. Nothing against my other guests. They're all amazing. You know we usually corner in on one specific thing, but all of us basically forget what it's like to be here.

Speaker 3: 59:14

Exactly here.

Speaker 1: 59:15

I try to remember as much as possible and luckily I'm immersed into it. You know, I deal with so many people a week. They bring me back quite often, you know, and I have to remember oh yeah, how'd I deal with that Sort of thing. But I think that in itself is value. Starting something is value. You guys know, right now you're fresh in the moment, right, if you could talk to Tyler in his first business, he could tell you a lot about what he's struggling with, right, you know, and what he could use help with and what questions he would have. And those would be the same questions out there in the world, right, and you guys probably noticed this with me sometimes. Sometimes it's so intuitive to me because I've been doing it so long I kind of like, and I'm pretty good at bringing it down to a level right. But, I'm sure that every once in a while, like I'm so you know like been doing it so long, it's like intuitive second nature to me right. And so that's why I think it's important to have these discussions, you know.

Speaker 3: 1:00:04

It is. It's important too, and it was like it was kind of funny because when you reached out and you text us and you asked us to be on the podcast, we both were like, really us. And then when you explain it the way you did, we were like, oh yeah, us, like this can actually bring value to people. And I will say, like I know we're getting closer, wrapping up this this has been really fun, like it has been a really enjoyable experience doing it the way that we're doing it. Yeah, there's some long nights and there's some nights where we're pissed off. There's some nights where frustrated, there's some days where it's like, bro, we can't do this today, or we scheduled this and now this person canceled, or we did this and this happened. But like we've had so much fun doing this part of it and like I can't wait to continue to stay in this stage and continue to work forward and continue to grind and continue to build the business, because this is it really has been a super enjoyable experience.

Speaker 1: 1:00:52

The hardest ones are the ones you're going to be most proud of, too. Exactly. It's like the ones that seem like the most pain in the butt are going to be the ones you remember the best.

Speaker 2: 1:01:00

You know.

Speaker 1: 1:01:01

It's like I had somebody on my bullying podcast and she said I try to be the hero that I wished I had, you know. And so, like I think that that's what we try to do with Glaive. It's like we try to be that person that we wish we would have had right to ask the questions too. It's like you know how nice it would have been to wander in a facility and have it at desk, where there's experts on the other side of the wall that'll come over and help you with anything you want to have help with. And not only that, but we're trying to build a community space here too, so you guys can network for more and more small business owners. Like I think this is the way you start to change things, and you guys know I'm a very passionate individual. You see a very raw dumb like what do you want to say? Calm down.

Speaker 3: 1:01:42

Copy on the video.

Speaker 1: 1:01:45

You guys get a lot more like wild Tyler runner out of the facility. But you know, it is my passion to help with this, like I absolutely think that I'm living the life that I'm supposed to be living. I think every hard lesson I've learned, you know, in life even comes out in like helping you guys. I get to, you know, put a piece into what you're doing every single day, and I absolutely feel blessed for being able to do that. And then, you know, when you guys are billionaires changing the world, I'll have had a piece of that right and so, and that's why I love what we're doing here and I love you guys being around here, you know, and it gives me, you know, like new faith every single day to be able to help with something you know that you guys are working on, or the other people that come in here.

Speaker 2: 1:02:27

So awesome. I think the last thing I want to say is just again, thank you guys for the space that you guys have given us. Something I kind of want to address you guys about like you know, we, you guys, might be sitting here looking at the podcast, like, oh well, like, yeah, you guys doing this because you got this man in front of you. Well, I want to tell you guys that if you guys are blessed to find somebody as great as Tyler or Elliot, like, understand that their time is valuable. You know, and it's not necessarily that, like, you gotta show them that you're worth their time, right, because there's not too much value that I can add to your life, right, but I wanted to show him that I wanted to earn your time because I understand that's so valuable. So, if you guys do find somebody out there, don't sit there and try to provide value to them, because you probably can't, especially if you had a boot shopper stage. So sit there and earn their time. And one of the ways that we earn their time is we came in every single day and we're working at the desk, but not only are we working at the desk. Whatever that they need help with, like if I sit there and I see, oh, like, the floor is dirty, like, oh, let me just go ahead and mop this or sweep this, because it adds time to you. So that's the only way that I can, in essence, give you some type of value, because I'm giving you your time back in that way right. So sit there and whenever you guys do find them into a certain third, go earn their time. Man, like, don't have pride and don't have this big old ego. No, no, no. Sit there and earn their time because you can't add value to them any other way. That's good, that's so good.

Speaker 1: 1:03:52

And, to be honest, it does. You guys, being around here does add value to me, right? Because then everything I've been through, the heartaches and things like that they mean something. So it does, and I love watching you guys grow and what you're doing. It adds fuel to my fire in a different way. When I was young, it was always people telling me I couldn't do something, and now it's more. It's like all these people are counting on me to do something. It's like there's one. I went and talked to this group and it's a bunch of underage or, excuse me, first generation college kids from rough neighborhoods. One kid stands up in the end. He's like Tyler, I'm gonna follow you Because I can't wait to see what you do next, and that is one of the things that motivates me. I'm about to write my goals again for this year, like I always do, and that's one of the people I think about when I write my goals. I'm like what is gonna make this kid proud? This?

Speaker 3: 1:04:41

year. That's awesome.

Speaker 1: 1:04:43

So I better get on doing some stuff, leave to Cambodia next month to fill in a little bit more for our docuseries. I better keep doing that stuff right, because now people count on you and that's a different feeling. And so I have to be an example to you guys. I would be no good just like not sweeping the floors or anything else. I would be no good to you guys if I didn't keep going out there trying to hustle in business, trying to do that's where I make my money. I don't sell any of this stuff. This is charity. It's like that's where I feel blessed. I get to use this knowledge and I get to give it away to the world and help people with it. Right, where my money is made is in business. That's where I think business people should make their money. I mean don't get me wrong there's nothing wrong with selling your hard earned work and talents on courses. I just find it more meaningful to give it to you guys, right?

Speaker 3: 1:05:29

And that's why to just continue to give you guys the praise you deserve. We're very spiritual in our religion and things like that. No matter what you believe in everyone they always talk about walking in your purpose or doing what you were put here to do. Finding out what you're here to do, you can tell you're walking in your purpose. And it's so rare for someone as successful as you are to not only give back but for I'm talking about free like nothing, like for you to sit here and like pour into us daily, and like we can't even put it into words and the people that we're gonna be able to reach, like you have a hand in that, like you're reaching these people as well, because without this place, without Clay, without you, elliot Martin, like we wouldn't be able to reach the people that we're gonna reach. And like you said, we're gonna do some cool things, we're gonna do some big things, and like it all starts here with you pouring in. So now we got the knowledge from you, we can pour it into the next generation, now they can pour it into the next one. I'm like I don't wanna downplay how big it is that you guys are doing here and like, like Kai was saying, if you're blessed enough to find somebody like this or find a mentor like this, like cherish it and value it. Cause I remember the first time we were in here, the meeting, you were like okay, through guys of series, we'll see you here every day and next week, like working on the website, and I remember that week I was going out of town and I was like, okay, I won't be here next week. And then Kai was like, yeah, I will. So then Kai sets up the phone on FaceTime and we're just I'm watching him work on the website, pitching ideas like take advantage of it. It's so rare what you guys are doing and it's we just can't thank you enough, bro. This is awesome. It really does mean more than you can imagine.

Speaker 1: 1:07:05

I mean, I think we're starting to change the world here, and that's what I love. We're starting to develop communities, we're starting to bring together good people. We're starting to use business as a way to change people's stars. You don't have to be from nothing forever, right, and like speaking of mentors or getting help or whatever we're available, right? I mean, I have people I talk to from all over the country. You fill in, you get on my schedule If you're ever in Phoenix. We have a free workspace here. We host the seminars. Eventually we'll be doing the live stream on the seminars too, so you can get this stuff too. You don't have to just be in the building and it's no catch to it.

Speaker 3: 1:07:40

It's like, and not only is he gonna show up and help, he's showing up prepared. Like Tyler shows up to our meetings with like okay, I know you guys wanna sell hats. Like, okay, I looked at this brand. They're selling hats. This, how much theirs cost. And we're like it was like at first, you know, and sometimes in the world you see people who are so willing to help and so nice, you always think like, okay, like, what's the catch? There really wasn't. Like, still to this day, there's not a catch. Like, it's like you truly are just giving back and not only just giving back like, oh, like here, just do this, do this. Like you're actually investing time to prepare and like invest in our business. Okay, like you're sitting down and showing us oh, this is what I did SEO on my website. These are the words that you guys might wanna look at. These are some websites you guys might wanna look at. These are applications we use. Like stuff like that. It's just mind blowing, still to this day, that there's somebody in your position, like in your shoes, that's actually willing to give back for no return. Like, obviously, like we're gonna promote and do things like that, but like, even if we weren't to do that, you still were willing to help us when we had nothing to give back, no value to add. Yeah, like it was like when we were not even like through him, wasn't even like a nothing on paper yet, Like we were just pitching the idea. Like you guys still came prepared and showed that you were willing to invest in us. Like that's huge, especially for small businesses. Not a lot of people have that, so it's just, it's so dope that you guys are doing this man.

Speaker 1: 1:08:53

No, I appreciate that a lot, because I do put a lot of work into preparing for every single meeting, every single one. I sit there and see you, doug.

Speaker 3: 1:09:00

Like I've seen you put together PowerPoint presentations and like bro, like Excel sheets and like going through, like on phone calls or whatever it is Like if they're out of town. Like okay, cool, we'll set up a Zoom call. Like to see the links that you guys go to. Like this is stuff where we talk about changing the world. Like this is stuff that can change the people who will eventually change the world. That's what this is.

Speaker 1: 1:09:21

I think absolutely. I mean even our seminars. Our seminars take a month to put together, you know, and it's like I'm in the building at 11 o'clock at night practicing it 50 times to make sure it's good the next day, you know, because at the same point is like we only have a finite amount of value or time in this world, right and so that I see that as value. You know, you guys might see it as spending an hour with me. I see it as taking an hour of your life, right and so, and like I can make you better in that hour, you know. And that's comes back to one more thing that I wanna get to in this episode. You guys, I know you as hard workers. I see you do it, and you've had a lot of, probably, jobs that you didn't love doing, much like myself. Please tell the people out there there is no reason not to do a good job in everything you're doing because eventually it will lead to the work ethic that you're doing now.

Speaker 2: 1:10:05

No, a thousand percent. I think that's exactly what it is. It's like how you do. One thing is how you do everything in life and my thing is is like, even if you're at like a job like Dollar Tree, like if you're gonna do it, we have a saying if you're gonna do it, do it, big dog, yeah that's it.

Speaker 3: 1:10:18

I can share a story. So when I was a production assistant, I worked on film sets and so this was I think this was six, seven months ago I was carrying a cooler, we were shooting in like a river and we had to carry the waters back up. And so I'm carrying the cooler and this it's heavy Bro like. It's full of ice like, and I'm not the biggest guy, so I'm struggling Like it took me a minute to get this cooler up the hill, but that's what the job was and I'm like all right, if I'm gonna be a production assistant, I'm gonna be the best one you've ever seen, or I'm gonna try to be. Yeah, so I hogged this cooler up. I kid you not. I think four or five months later I get a call from a lady from she was actually one of the executives at Netflix and I got a really cool opportunity to be like a part of a Netflix show. I got to meet like a producer who's produced like like Beyonce films. Like I've got a chance to network and build the biggest opportunity to date that I've had. And the only reason she knew who I was was because I got recommended by a guy who was just watching me hog the cooler up the trail. I've never met him To this day. I've never met this dude in person. I didn't know his name, nothing. When she said he recommended me, I didn't know who he was. That's the best example I could give of like yo, no matter what job you're in, just do it to the best of your ability. And if you're not gonna do this, well, how are you gonna do whatever goal you have? Well, if you're not willing to wipe these toilets, well, there's no way you're gonna run that $100 million business.

Speaker 1: 1:11:36

Well, Please, please, please, take that advice. And you know we're gonna do the roundup kind of together, usually a roundup into the camera, but it's like that is so essential and it sounds like it's like stupid, right? Oh, I'm gonna work this hard for somebody else's money. No, you're working for you, right? It's like I used to work for a country club. They were some of the biggest personal lessons I learned on the planet were working at that country club because they were awful to me, right, but I went out there every day and every morning I was a valet, right. And so you start somewhere too, right? Every morning I was a valet started at six o'clock in the morning. Every afternoon I switched to a bartender and I worked till night, right, and when I valed, I wasn't walking to your car, I wasn't moseying to your car, I was sprinting to your car in 125 degree weight and it was a huge parking lot, right. I saw it as no other way than to do it the best I possibly. It doesn't matter what they're doing to me and please get this, because eventually it's gonna be the key to your success. Among the other things we've talked about here today. You guys have brought gold here today. I think we're gonna actually have to circle back around in a couple months and see how things are going.

Speaker 3: 1:12:38

I think it's gonna be a thing, it'll be dope.

Speaker 1: 1:12:40

Yeah, I mean, I think there's a lot of value in talking to people when they're in the moment, and so and I didn't bring you guys on here to vouch for Glaver or anything like that I, literally, as the audience, I thought that it would be super helpful to talk to some people that are actually in here working on some stuff, talk about the fears, and the fears are not what you think they are. No, you think the LLC is scary and you think an EIN is scary. No, and that's what I love. It's like we get to help with all that and get that fear away. And then, other than that, it's dragging the cooler up the hill every single day to prepare. It's working, a thankless job that you hate, right, Because then you can learn to appreciate working for yourself. It's letting these people, not letting them. It's being subjected to some of the people that aren't fair to you in life so you can prove them wrong. Right, I'm never going to the country club. My first couple of years in business and it was scary. I used to keep a picture of myself at the country club. You want to go back there?

Speaker 3: 1:13:35

You really want to go back there.

Speaker 1: 1:13:37

You better get back to what you're doing, right. And so those mentalities and not quitting and things like that led to what I get to do today, which is my life purpose around helping people like you guys. So, amazing and getting to my life is truly blessed because of the things I get to do today. Amen. So yeah, in the future, tell us what you want to get. We'll bring the guys back for in a couple months or whatever. Have some questions? Leave some questions in the comments, I'll get with them. I see them quite often these days. If you're in the area, come on by. We have a free workspace for you to come and use anytime. Doesn't matter if you're young guys like these guys or 50 years old starting your plumbing company. Doesn't matter. At the same point too, if you just want some one-on-one help, you can still book into my schedule. I still make time for that. Next month is tough because I'm traveling. But yeah, thank you once again. Turning into underdogs, bootstrappers and game-chainers Sometimes I even have to check the title. Thanks, people.